Move parts of an image - am I missing something really basic

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McBarry
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Move parts of an image - am I missing something really basic

Postby McBarry » Sun Jan 04, 2015 11:24 am

Hi Folks,
long story short.. trying to create a logo..
I've done circles, text in circles, shadings, colours.. but for the life of me I cannot achieve the following...
Edit the below image to a) cut out just the centre portion
b)Invert the colours
c)lower the hands a few mm, raise the head a few mm
b) insert a guitar neck inside the grip of each hand
Underneath is an earlier effort and after inserting the geetar necks I"ll add a bit of blue probably to perimeter to balance the colours a bit and I'm done..

But for the love of god.. I'm pulling my hair out on how to outline the hands and then lower a bit and then insert the guitar necks as well as outline the head and raise it a bit - all to make a bit more room for the guitar necks..

ALL ideas / help / direction most greatly and graciously appreciated.

Cheers,Dave


Image

Image

{Moderator edit -- Links to html files have been removed for safety.}
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tylerdurden
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby tylerdurden » Sun Jan 04, 2015 12:23 pm

Presuming the art has been converted to paths, it is likely you will have to edit nodes.

BTnodes.jpg
BTnodes.jpg (103.27 KiB) Viewed 9650 times

Select the skull nodes or the arm nodes and use arrow keys to move.
Have a nice day.

I'm using Inkscape 0.92.2 (5c3e80d, 2017-08-06), 64 bit win8.1

The Inkscape manual has lots of helpful info! http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/
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ragstian
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby ragstian » Sun Jan 04, 2015 1:58 pm

Hi.

First thing striking me is about this post;
if the guy made this in Inkscape and not being capable of separating the arms and skull from the rest of the image something is not right.

When saving the skull_xxx.gif and trying to open it as a gif file it fails to open, examining it in an text editor shows the file to be.html
Last edited by ragstian on Sun Jan 04, 2015 3:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Good Luck!
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
RGDS
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brynn
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby brynn » Sun Jan 04, 2015 3:27 pm

Yeah, those are both html files. If no one objects, I'll do whatever I can to get rid of those 2 links. I know I've been not moderating for awhile, but this is a security issue, and I don't want anyone to have trouble. Lazur's not far away, I don't think, but better safe than...
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McBarry
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby McBarry » Sun Jan 04, 2015 5:51 pm

Guys,
I'm about as far removed from a spammer as possible..
Yes, it's true, I was able to do a bucket-load of schmick stuff in IS that resulted in the lower image.. Which is why I'm so frustrated at being unable to cut/past/move/WHATEVER the hands/head of the other image.

My fervent hope is someone says" Oh dude, you're doing it wrong.. U need to think of it THIS way.." and point me in the right direction..

Tylerdurden has suggested the nodes idea so I'm going to try and acomplish this.. although I might add I"m a complete newb at this so assumed knowledge is probably my undoing...

Anyway, thx for any/all thought thus far...
Cheers from Down Under,
Dave
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brynn
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby brynn » Sun Jan 04, 2015 6:37 pm

If the GIF image is the actual image you want to edit, you won't be able to do it with Inkscape. That's because Inkscape is a vector editor and GIF is a raster format. "apples and oranges" as they say. However, you can use that image to create a new one, which has vector elements, which you can edit.

You probably can use Path menu > Trace Bitmap, to quickly get paths for the head and hands. Once you have the paths, you can move them.

http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/Trace.html

If you can't get a good enough automatic trace, with Trace Bitmap, you'll have to trace them by hand, using the Pen or Pencil tool (Pen would be best, but Pencil will work).

http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL ... ths-Bezier
http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL ... ths-Pencil
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Lazur
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby Lazur » Sun Jan 04, 2015 10:46 pm

Something like this?:
juxta1.png
juxta1.png (74.73 KiB) Viewed 9569 times
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McBarry
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby McBarry » Mon Jan 05, 2015 4:18 am

OK...
I feel like a complete dunce now...

but yes, that's the idea.. 2 geetar necks crossed and being held by the hands...

Dare I even ask how to do it ??
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Xav
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby Xav » Mon Jan 05, 2015 4:22 am

If you've got a complex path with lots of nodes, I usually find it's easier to break it into smaller sections using boolean operations, rather than trying to edit the nodes.

In this case I would draw a path that covers the hands, but not the skull. It only needs to be a rough shape so use the Bezier tool to click out a few straight lines to form an enclosing polygon. Then duplicate both the base path and the polygon, moving the duplicated pair to one side so you can see what you're doing.

Now select the original path and its polygon, then use Path > Difference to remove the part covered by the polygon. Select the copy of the path and its polygon then use Path > Intersection to keep only the part covered by the polygon. Move the hands back into place and you've now got two separate paths that can be moved around at will.
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Lazur
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby Lazur » Mon Jan 05, 2015 4:37 am

^-- Or just break apart the path (Ctrl+Shift+K), and combine the subpaths back together (Ctrl+K) into two separate compound paths.

Compositing the guitars with the hands:
put the guitars at the bottom, the hands in the middle, and masked/clipped duplicants of the guitars on top.
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McBarry
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby McBarry » Mon Jan 05, 2015 2:31 pm

Sorry guys..
I'm outta my league here..
There is something basic I mustn't be doing because I'm not able to achieve what U kind folks are expounding..
Feeling like I'm trying to run before I can even crawl...
I'll look at it when I'm off nightshift and can at least think..

regards, Dave
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brynn
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby brynn » Mon Jan 05, 2015 3:29 pm

Dare I even ask how to do it ??


Didn't you already ask how to do it.....when you posted those.html
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McBarry
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby McBarry » Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:11 pm

Well.. yeah.. I did ask.
But what is clear to me now is I need detailed help..
Revising easier tutorials would definitely help.. and when I get off nightshift I will attend to that..
Cheers, DB
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Xav
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby Xav » Mon Jan 05, 2015 11:14 pm

Lazur URH wrote:^-- Or just break apart the path (Ctrl+Shift+K), and combine the subpaths back together (Ctrl+K) into two separate compound paths.


I tend to avoid that approach for a couple of reasons:

1) Breaking a complex path like this can often lead inexperienced users into a panic moment when the details seem to vanish on breaking apart.
2) A potentially complex selection is then required before re-combining. One a complex path it can be easy to miss one of the sub-paths when re-selecting the parts to combine, leading to more confusion.

Of course both approaches end up with the same result, but I've found that inexperienced users trying to work with complex shapes tend to get on better with the "draw a rough shape to use for cutting" method.


McBarry wrote:But what is clear to me now is I need detailed help.


It's still not entirely clear if you have a complex path or a bitmap image in your design. We could get more detailed or specific with the instructions if it was clearer what you're dealing with. Can you upload your SVG file for us to take a look at?
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Lazur
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby Lazur » Tue Jan 06, 2015 12:28 am

Xav wrote:
Lazur URH wrote:^-- Or just break apart the path (Ctrl+Shift+K), and combine the subpaths back together (Ctrl+K) into two separate compound paths.


I tend to avoid that approach for a couple of reasons:

1) Breaking a complex path like this can often lead inexperienced users into a panic moment when the details seem to vanish on breaking apart.
2) A potentially complex selection is then required before re-combining. One a complex path it can be easy to miss one of the sub-paths when re-selecting the parts to combine, leading to more confusion.

Of course both approaches end up with the same result, but I've found that inexperienced users trying to work with complex shapes tend to get on better with the "draw a rough shape to use for cutting" method.



On the other hand, boolean operation would need duplicating the shape
-which doubles the number of nodes to deal with. Even if only for a short time, it may result in performance issue. Wasted seconds, or more lagging with a more complex path.

Also boolean operation re-renders the path; it won't be exact.
At least in the current stabile, there is a 0,2 px inaccuracy.
Have to admit it can make a good use if the path segments are intersecting sometime.


The breaking apart usability/visibility can largely improved if the object's transparency is lowered to about 50% before.

Yes, selecting should be much easier after. Maybe some day inkscape will incorporate blender's lasso tool.
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brynn
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby brynn » Tue Jan 06, 2015 2:25 am

Can you upload your SVG file for us to take a look at?


It sounds like op has given up, at least for now:

I'll look at it when I'm off nightshift and can at least think.


But I'm not convinced this is a sincere request, because of the spam originally posted (see Ragnar's reply and mine). I did remove 2 links to html files!
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McBarry
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby McBarry » Tue Jan 06, 2015 9:30 am

Hey folks...
maybe I should have "given up..." - I saved the working file as an exported gif... damn.. damn...no more original SVG..
I'm going to start afresh, get a clean new slate, pay attention to layers (which I wasn't before) and the myriad of other things on my steep learning curve..
Again, thx for ideas / thoughts - much appreciated !
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McBarry
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby McBarry » Tue Jan 06, 2015 3:13 pm

DDT with centre.svg
(17.31 KiB) Downloaded 202 times
After a few shennanigins.. with names, and inclusions etc etc.. here's the outcome..

I'd prefer to be able to conver the center image to just a corcle so the surrounding black background int he square shape is omitted.. but will settle for this in the interim.

Thx for all thoughts and tips - many were above my skill level but I'm not done just yet..
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tylerdurden
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby tylerdurden » Tue Jan 06, 2015 10:39 pm

I'd say that's progress, of a sort.

Because the guy and the crosshairs are a single object, a quick way to make the black (dark green) background a circle, would be:
put a circle on top of it
select both
use menu : Object >Mask >Set.
Have a nice day.

I'm using Inkscape 0.92.2 (5c3e80d, 2017-08-06), 64 bit win8.1

The Inkscape manual has lots of helpful info! http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/
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Lazur
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Logo design

Postby Lazur » Thu Jan 08, 2015 6:03 am

Seeing the guitar concept has changed, might add that probably it's better start off again from scratch.


Check these topics for some hints:

http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=4750

http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=17427#p63980

http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=15266#p57166


Edit: tags: logo, design, logodesign, graphic, brand, branding, visual, corporate, profession, ad,
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McBarry
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby McBarry » Thu Jan 08, 2015 10:26 am

Guys,

Lazur has brought to my attention my error of linking to an external site for the original images and then not bothering to apologise for confusion caused.

Briefly, I linked to photobucket because that's where I host all my images for most other forums, mainly those on valve guitar amplifier repair, where I'm very active.. (I built and fix them as a sideline business..)
I had no idea it would cause consternation, nor was it such a transgression on this particular board.
Let me be very clear and explicit that I apologise.

Regarding the new design, yes, I strted again went with something my newbie level could work with.

I did try tylerdun's suggestion but had problems with final opacity despite trying many ideas, so left it with the perimiter obscuring the circle.

Thanks again for thoughts in-process.
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Lazur
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby Lazur » Thu Jan 08, 2015 12:26 pm

Right.


So, here is a rough explanation, if you don't like ponies.

Image

Images used:
mechanical hand by johnny_automatic

https://openclipart.org/detail/10070/flying-v-black-guitar-by-worms_x-10070 by worms_x

https://openclipart.org/detail/28360/guitar-by-maxim2 by maxim2


Even after knowing how to do these, it won't make a good logo automagically.

Good luck!
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Lazur
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby Lazur » Wed Jan 21, 2015 12:59 am

Above tutorial is now also available here.
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Janne
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Re: Move parts of an image - am I missing something really b

Postby Janne » Wed Jan 21, 2015 1:31 am

Lazur URH wrote:Above tutorial is now also available here.


Thank you, Lazur - I'm quite confident with clipping and masking but your explanation is worth watching anyway :)
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