Vortex Challenge

Raspi · Postby **Raspi** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:01 am

I made this vortex image all afternoon and hit several obstacles.

For example, i made the basic ring shape out of eight segments with tiled clones (all strokes) and my plan was to dupliate the combined shape, resize and interpolate, but that wasnt possible because the gaps between the segments get scaled as well.

I also tried to tile-clone the whole thing in one go, but that wasnt possbile either, because the strokewidth of each segement gets scaled down, not just the diameter of the whole ring.

I also tried to make the concentric rings as a combined shape and then divide in one go with a multi-cross shape, but that doesnt work either.

In the end i got my result, but it took a lot of trial and error. Is there a simple way im missing ?

Raspi · Postby **Raspi** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:13 am

Here is what it looks like when i try to clone:

Lazur · Postby **Lazur** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:22 am

Hi.

There is an icon at the top you can switch off to not scale the strokes proportionally with the resize. Maybe that would solve it?

Raspi · Postby **Raspi** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:37 am

Lazur wrote:Hi.

There is an icon at the top you can switch off to not scale the strokes proportionally with the resize. Maybe that would solve it?

Nope.

Moini · Postby **Moini** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:02 am

Another option (needs refining for correct proportions):

Zeichnung.svg: (174.39 KiB) Downloaded 170 times

Raspi · Postby **Raspi** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:09 am

Moini wrote:Another option (needs refining for correct proportions):

Zeichnung.svg

That was one of the strategies i tried as well. Yours works better because you combined two shapes to cut the path, but as you can see, you have the problem the gaps are overlapping, the smaller the rings get.
The gaps must stay consistent.

Lazur · Postby **Lazur** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:18 am

Raspi wrote:Nope.

Ok, that was my first guess by the second image. My bad.

Moini wrote:Zeichnung.svg

At the second step convert stroke to path and use that for cutting instead of rotating duplicants.

Raspi · Postby **Raspi** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:37 am

Lazur wrote:
Moini wrote:Zeichnung.svg

At the second step convert stroke to path and use that for cutting instead of rotating duplicants.

You must make the cutting path very wide, but then its difficult to delete all the excess.
Even more difficult the more segments you have.
Eight is managable.

Moini · Postby **Moini** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:38 am

For consistent gaps. maybe the vertex raw shape could be 'stroke to path'ed instead of duplicated/rotated after setting a stroke width that fits the gap size?

Moini · Postby **Moini** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:38 am

Ah, Lazur said it

Just understood that after posting.

Raspi · Postby **Raspi** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:41 am

Moini wrote:For consistent gaps. maybe the vertex raw shape could be 'stroke to path'ed instead of duplicated/rotated after setting a stroke width that fits the gap size?

I think you could just start with straight cutting and then rotate each ring by 5°.

BTW, here is the original discotunnel i tried to make.
Dont get me started on the colourgrading.
Interpolating just to get a colourgradient is impossible as well, even when you have the final result.

theozh · Postby **theozh** » Sat Feb 18, 2017 4:08 pm

Nice challenge

I don't know whether there are suitable LPEs or tiled clones options to easily reproduce this in "one shot" (at least haven't found).
If this is the pattern you want to reproduce I would put this image in a layer below your drawing so you can easily check an guess the proportions and parameters. There are "just" a few parameters to determine: circle diameter, arc length, scaling to the inner circles, rotation shift, ...
One way could be:
1. Draw Circle (grey) Diameter (in my case) 326mm, Stroke 6mm
2. Duplicate Cirle
3. Reduce to red Arc (11.5° is a good value)
4. Select arc and move (snap) its rotation center to the center of the grey circle

5. Duplicate and rotate 180°
6. Select both arcs
7. transform (Shift+Ctrl+M) Scale 95% is a good value
8. duplicate + transform again with 95%.... repeat about 10 times

9. rotate inner arcs (2.5° is a good value)
10. group the arcs
11. move the rotation center of the group to the center of the grey circle

12. duplicate and rotate the group by 15°, 24 times
13. color the groups

14. add black background and a black blurred circle on top...

: VortexConstruction.png (65.66 KiB) Viewed 3120 times

theozh · Postby **theozh** » Sat Feb 18, 2017 7:26 pm

Now, that I just have learned how tiled clones with a "external" rotational center can be realized,
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=31836
there might be further simplifications, probably also with coloring and gradients.

Postby **brynn** » Sat Feb 18, 2017 8:00 pm

I seem to have gotten myself so busy that I hardly have time for Inkscape. But I'm thinking the new gradient mesh could probably create something like a vortex effect. If I get spare few minutes, I'll give it a try.

Raspi · Postby **Raspi** » Sat Feb 18, 2017 9:11 pm

theozh wrote:Nice challenge

Thanks for taking the challenge and good job !

EDIT: see below !

Im having a few issues with your solution.

When i duplicate the arc, rotate 180° and then transform both, the gap between the arcs get smaller and smaller, while in my attempts they stayed the same and that was one of the obstacles why so many techniques (including tiled clones) didnt work.
You could debate the gaps are getting smaller in the original as well, but the amount is much smaller !

Also the colouring is actually a full rotation through the spectrum, and through the whole piece !
Somehting i have tried here:
viewtopic.php?f=22&t=31823#p96327

Also sticking a gradient on top of the whole thing, as Brynn suggests, is not the solution because every arc represents its own part of the spectrum.
Every arc has one colour !

What i'd like to see is:
a) the gaps between the arcs stay consistent.
b) the gaps between the rings stay consistent.

Postby **brynn** » Sat Feb 18, 2017 9:20 pm

No, I didn't suggest applying a mesh to your drawing. I meant using a gradient mesh by itself. I thought this was a challenge for everyone, but I might have misunderstood.

Well if you grouped all the objects together, you could apply a mesh gradient, but it probably would not work very well with that.

Raspi · Postby **Raspi** » Sat Feb 18, 2017 9:27 pm

What im looking for is a way to interpolate colours through the spectrum, where each objects is only one colour.
Im sure we have the tools, but to my knowledge it hasnt been done before.

Getting an effect that is visually somewhat similar with a gradient or gradient mesh is fine, but also tedious to set up.

Raspi · Postby **Raspi** » Sat Feb 18, 2017 9:39 pm

Let me rephrase my original reply to theozh:

i think you nailed the basic effect !
Its very close to the original image.
Great job !

If this was done in Illustrator, its probably the way they did it (Transform).

What i tried to achieve is a different effect.

Now what i want to know is, how can we select all arcs and make them rotate through the spectrum, where each arc has only one colour ?

theozh · Postby **theozh** » Sat Feb 18, 2017 10:08 pm

Thanks @Raspi

, I had fun and learned quite a few new things again.

Raspi wrote:Now what i want to know is, how can we select all arcs and make them rotate through the spectrum, where each arc has only one colour ?

I think the individual segments in the original have the same color (although the first ring after the grey circle seems to be a bit off sometimes, and to me it looks like accidentally and not obeying a gradient or certain rule). The arcs are getting darker towards the center which you can achieve with the black blurred circle on top.
It should also be possible to have color gradients clones in two dimensions (somehow playing with rows and columns?!?). Haven't figured out yet.
Basically, you are starting with a single arc which needs scaling + rotation + color gradient (color with the circumference and getting darker to the center). Should somehow be possible...

Raspi · Postby **Raspi** » Sat Feb 18, 2017 10:29 pm

Here is a rough attempt at cloning the whole thing in one go, using theozh's approach, and rotating it through the spectrum.
Its not perfect, but its getting there.
One issue i have is when i assign an Unset Stroke colour, the objects become invisible.
So had to convert the stroke into paths.

Raspi · Postby **Raspi** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:07 am

Just realized i forgot the rotation...

Postby **brynn** » Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:28 pm

I did something like that manually once, with a spirogram. But I couldn't find a way to do it automatically. It was one of the first things I did with Inkscape, and I was happy with what I learned. But I just colored each sort of row, with a small change of lightness in each row.

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